By
John Orquiola
Published 19 minutes ago
John Orquiola is a New & Classic TV Editor, Senior Writer, and Interviewer with a special focus on Star Trek. John has over 4,000 published articles at SR, and he has interviewed the biggest names in Star Trek on the red carpet and VIP events, among other beloved shows, movies, and franchises.
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Nana Visitor proudly looks back on her time on Star Trek: Deep Space Nine as a flashpoint for the continuing evolution of how women in Star Trek are portrayed. Visitor played Major Kira Nerys in all seven seasons of Star Trek: Deep Space Nine, who was the First Officer of Captain Benjamin Sisko (Avery Brooks).
In 2024, Nana Visitor wrote Star Trek: Open a Channel: A Woman's Trek. Seeking to understand how Star Trek has portrayed women throughout the generations, Visitor interviewed many of her fellow actors, learning from the stories of the women of Star Trek: The Original Series to the female-centric cast of Star Trek: Strange New Worlds.
Visitor has been gratified by the success of Star Trek: Open a Channel: A Woman's Trek, which has been read by male Star Trek fans and people in the industry, as well as women. Visitor says the lesson of Open a Channel can be summed up by what Star Trek: Lower Decks creator Mike McMahan told her: "If you love a system, you must question it to keep yourself healthy and the system healthy. And I believe that's true." Nana adds:
Women, young men, older men, people who were on the show, I've heard a lot of people saying, 'I just didn't know'. And it was like, 'Yeah, of course, because we didn't talk about it back then,' That's the difference. We didn't even know the cultural amber we were stuck in, we just accepted the rules of the system.
ScreenRant's John Orquiola had the honor of chatting with Nana Visitor about playing the revolutionary Major Kira Nerys on Star Trek: Deep Space Nine and her appearance at Creation Entertainment's ST: CHI - Trek to Chicago convention, where Nana will join Star Trek fans at a DS9 themed cocktail hour.
Nana Visitor Is Proud That DS9 Is The Foundation For How Women In Star Trek Are Portrayed Today
ScreenRant: DS9's female characters were the real revolution in Star Trek. In terms of the kind of stories and the depth of characterizations you had, I don't think you get to Captain Janeway, or Seven of Nine, or Michael Burnham, or Mariner, without DS9 laying that foundation. Kira had stories that were incredible. The type of stuff that Kira got to do, and the scope of her life, her romances, and her religion, I think Burnham is really the only one in modern Star Trek to come close to the kind of stuff you got to do.
Nana Visitor: I'm so proud to think that we were shoulders that these young women could stand on. I love that. There's that story, and I say it in the book, of the butterflies. We used to think that the migration of butterflies was one generation going from Canada to Mexico, and we recently found out that's simply not true. There are many generations that stop in different places, until finally the last generation gets to its intended destination. And I feel like that is true for us. You know, we got a certain distance so that the next ones could get further.
Nana Visitor Loved How "Human" Major Kira Was (Despite Being Bajoran)
ScreenRant: What were your favorite stories you got to do on DS9?
Nana Visitor: There were so many. There were times that I got to depict the nuance of life, the gray of life, anytime Kira was morally [challenged], ethics mattered so much to her. Anytime her ethics were possibly questionable, those were my favorite stories, because it's so human. I mean, Kira was such a human character taken out of any cultural need to be performative in a female way at all.
Unless she was back with her mother, and Dukat, and the pleasure women. That was a different story. And I look like a wet cat. I look at those things where I'm all dressed up sexy, and I look like a wet cat. And I go, 'Yeah, that was the right thing. That's what Kira would have felt.' It was just, 'This ain't right.' But the moral ambiguity, the questions, the failing, being given a chance to to fix her mistakes or see herself in a new light. Those were my favorite shows.
I loved the show where I was pregnant and captured by a Cardassian and confronted with what I had done. Those were amazing shows. I also love the silly ones, like, where I got to be a ridiculous Russian spy.
Nana Visitor Remembers Interviewing Star Trek: Discovery's Sonequa Martin-Green
Image by Simone Ashmoore
ScreenRant: You interviewed most of the current female Star Trek actors for your book. Not to ask you to play favorites, but who was your favorite to interview?
Nana Visitor: Oh my god. Oh, so many people. I'll say that Sonequa [Martin-Green] was remarkable. I came in with a chip on my shoulder, because everyone from [Star Trek: Discovery] was like, 'Oh my god, Sonequa!' And I thought, this is a little too cultish for me. They must be like protecting their star, or something. And then I talked to her, and I came out the same way: Oh, my God. What a human being.
She was an unbelievably honest, raw interview. And thoughtful, connected, not giving me easy... Because we do so many interviews, it's so easy to get into this pattern that you tell the same thing to everybody, and it's safe, and you've crafted it. She didn't do that. She just said, 'Here's my truth.' She was incredibly impressive.
Also, Jess Bush [from Star Trek: Strange New Worlds], Jess is amazing. She's a very impressive woman. I expect to see a lot from both of them. I'm already seeing a lot from Sonequa. But from both of them, I expect big things.
Nana Visitor Wishes Kate Mulgrew's Captain Janeway Could Have Crossed Over To Star Trek: Deep Space Nine
ScreenRant: If you had a time machine, and you could pick any of the women from the other Star Trek shows to bring to DS9 and integrate that character and that actor into your show, who do you think would fit in best in your show?
Nana Visitor: I thought you were going to ask me a different question. If I could go back, who I'd want to interview. That would be Grace Lee Whitney. But to bring into the show… I would love to work with Kate Mulgrew. She has the whole Captain command aura and presence about her, and that would be a real upheaval to the show. How would that work out? I see sparks all over the place, and with Captain Sisko. Not sure they’d get along. Those are two alphas. I think that would be really interesting.
Nana Visitor Reacts To Major Kira Possibly Commanding Deep Space Nine Longer Than Captain Sisko
ScreenRant: I did a little Star Trek math. In the timeline of Star Trek, DS9 ended in 2375. That was when the finale happened. And then you appeared on Lower Decks as Kira, and that happened in 2381. So six years. And then Lower Decks ended two years later. So, assume Kira is still running DS9. That means Kira has possibly run the station for eight years, and that's longer than Captain Sisko.
Nana Visitor: That's right, and that feels right to me. I like that story that I was still there, because I think I would be. I think a major storyline would be between Jake Sisco and me. I would imagine that I remained a mentor to him.
ScreenRant: It's a testament to what a milestone character Kira is that she's still in command of the station. Do you have any thoughts about how Sisko's original mission when the show started was to bring Bajor to the Federation, and then seven years goes by, the Dominion War happens, the show ends, and Bajor still wasn't a member of the Federation. And we don't actually know if they ever joined, which I think is really interesting.
Nana Visitor: I think it's interesting too, and I think it's interesting if maybe they didn't [join the Federation], and just kept their independence, and they worked with the Federation from there.
Nana Visitor Stands Firm That Kira And Gul Dukat Could Never Be A Couple
ScreenRant: Kira had a few love interests on DS9. One of the things I totally agree with you about that would never happen is Kira and Dukat. God knows, Dukat tried all seven years. But even if Dukat didn't sleep with Kira's mother, nothing could be more wrong than Kira and Dukat together.
Nana Visitor: (laughs) Yeah, I think the writers thought, 'Well, that makes it interesting.' And also, I think a lot of people found Dukat [to be] not only a great character, but romantically, almost interesting. He had this thing. There were a lot of women who liked him, but I believe that would be jumping the shark.
ScreenRant: You're right, Dukat has that whole 'I can fix him' vibe.
Nana Visitor: Yeah, 'he's a bad boy, but he means well.' No, he's a sociopath, you cannot fix that. You can't. Narcissists are good at convincing you of the person that you want to see reflected back at you. He's just so good at that.
Nana Visitor Pitches A Different Keira & O'Brien DS9 Love Story
ScreenRant: You were pregnant during DS9 season 5, and they concocted that whole storyline where Kira was a surrogate of Keiko and Miles O'Brien's baby so that you could be pregnant on the show. There was a point in that storyline where Kira and Miles were attracted to each other, and they almost did something, and then they stopped themselves. Do you have any memories of playing that?
Nana Visitor: Working with Colm [Meaney] is a dream. He's just an incredible actor. It's easy to go, 'Well, he makes it look so easy.' It's just this natural thing. He's incredible. So working with him was wonderful. Looking back at it, really, the scenes should have been between Keiko and me. I think that would have been much more truthful, much more filled with gray area, and unresolved feelings, and unclear feelings. That would have been the storyline to pursue. And I think if we were doing it today, that's what the writers would have done.
ScreenRant: I remember in the documentary, What We Leave Behind, [showrunner] Ira Steven Behr didn't give himself a check mark, because he didn't do enough LGBTQ stories and representation.
Nana Visitor: Sign of the times. But I have to say there's, there was such usefulness, because everyone recognizes themselves in the stories immediately. It doesn't really matter. And those stories were useful to get some people who are uncomfortable closer. And instead of going, 'No, that's someone I don't know in my life,' they would get to know the character slowly and form a relationship with them in their heart, and then have to accept them. 'Okay, so this is what this stands for.' It's like a slow boil. I think DS9 was useful in that way.
Nana Visitor Fondly Looks Back At Kira And Odo's Romance And Working With Rene Auberjonois
ScreenRant: My favorite Kira romance — to be honest, my favorite of all Star Trek romances — is Kira and Odo. Unrequited love is something I think we can all relate to. And then it's a story of pining for a girl, unrequited love, feeling you're not good enough, and then you level up, and then you get the girl. I just love that whole relationship and how it played out, and then, of course, letting each other go at the end. I would love to know your feelings on Kira and Odo, and also your memories of Rene [Auberjonois], who's been gone for a few years now.
Nana Visitor: I have this weird thing that I can't formulate in my mind people's faces that I aren't in front of me. I have difficulty recognizing many people. But I can [see Rene] right here in front of me, his face. I feel him all the time now. I wish I could feel my mother, who is gone now since 2000, the way Rene is present for me. I don't know why he's so vibrant for me, but he is, and I miss him every day.
He taught me so much in such small, tiny ways. I remember saying to him, 'I never want to do Broadway again.' And he said, 'Think about that. Wait, stop. Where is that coming from? What you feel or what you fear?' And that was all he said about it. And I thought for the next couple of years about that. Things like that, he made me think about, so he was a big deal in my life. He was incredible to work with. He was like an actor's actor to me. I was vibrating that we actually worked together. I couldn't believe i. That was really a thrill. Not always easy, but a thrill, always a thrill.
I felt like the writers got it wrong with Kira [until Odo]. She wouldn't have wanted muscle men or hunks, or men of power, or men of daring. That's not what mattered to her. That's not where she lived. She wasn't looking at hierarchy or power, or this is the most anything in terms of a mate. So it was perfect that this was a shapeshifter, that it didn't matter what shape he was in. Could be a woman, a man. It didn't matter, an eagle. Or just golden light. It was the soul she loved. It was who he was that she loved. And that made so much sense to me. That's the right partner for her.
Nana Visitor Is Excited For Trek To Chicago's DS9 Cocktail Hour
ScreenRant: You're one of the headline Star Trek actors at Creation Entertainment's ST: CHI Trek to Chicago convention, and you're doing something extra fun. A DS9 cocktail hour. Tell me what that is.
Nana Visitor: That is some of the most fun, when we can just hang together and talk about whatever we want to talk about. I love that interaction. I find out the most interesting things about these people who are on the frequency of Star Trek with us. They are extraordinary. Some of the most extraordinary [people[. It's like, you're what? You're dressed like Grace Lee Whitney and you're head doctor at where? Or just these amazing stories, not even with what they do, but with who they are. So that is my favorite.
The only thing I wish is that I could get back there and bartend, because I love cocktails. I love making cocktails, and if I could, I'd have everyone to my house. We actually have a bar in the house. And it's not like we're heavy drinkers, but when we drink, it's got to be really exquisite. So I'm involved in that part of it. I also make zero alcohol drinks pretty well. So I wish I was mixing, but I'll be mixing with people instead of mixing the drinks, because that would take all my attention. So it's much better this way.
Nana Visitor's Pitch For A Live-Action Star Trek: Deep Space Nine Reunion
ScreenRant: I still yearn for a live-action DS9 revival of any sort. Obviously, we lost some of the cast over the years, so a full reunion isn't possible, but I want everybody else to come back together somehow. Having said that, Star Trek has new management now with Paramount Skydance. So is there anything that you've been mulling over for years that you want to pitch? Any ideas you've been kicking around? Let's manifest this. They might see this interview.
Nana Visitor: Well, something that I've always seen is I'm still on the station, and Cirroc [Lofton] is there, and I'll even dream further that Avery [Brooks]'s voice comes out of an orb, and we can both access that. That seems like a really interesting idea. I mean, it's a space station. It's just a wonderful, useful way to put people together, and different species together,
Nana Visitor Remembers Working With James Cameron And Jessica Alba On Dark Angel
Dark Angel Jessica Alba as Max
ScreenRant: One of the shows I really loved after DS9 ended was Dark Angel. You came on at the end of season one as the villain, Dr. Elizabeth Renfro. Do you have memories of your time on that show?
Nana Visitor: It was a wild time for me because I was doing Chicago on Broadway, and they would fly me to Vancouver and do all my scenes at once in two days. Chicago would give me an additional day off, and then I’d fly back and do the show. And I did that for a while. I had two young [kids], I had an eight-year-old and a four-year-old. So it was like I was out of my mind, exhausted. I remember getting to Vancouver one time, and I was getting a massage thinking, ‘This will help me,’ but the minute she touched me, I had a panic attack just from being so tired, and I was like, ‘Don't touch me’. And the poor woman, I know she probably thought, ‘What did I do?’ But I couldn't explain to her, I'm really so sleep deprived and out of my head, trying to achieve both jobs, plus be there as much as I could for my children that I was just gone. That's a big memory for me.
Jessica [Alba] was sweet and wonderful to work with. When I met James Cameron, wow. He told me about my character, told me what they wanted, and said she's probably 100 or more years old, so that's what she's doing with the children. She's getting the DNA to keep herself young, and that's why she's chasing them. So it was so fascinating.
But then, I can't remember who was making the show at the time [showrunner Charles H. Eglee]... they decided it was going to be all young people. They got rid of everybody who was over 40. Cameron left, and it became a very different show. So I was gone, we were all gone, unfortunately. But I do believe [that] if James Cameron's version had been allowed to grow, it would have been a very interesting show.
Star Trek: Deep Space Nine is available to stream on Paramount+.
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Star Trek: Deep Space Nine
10 stars 9 stars 8 stars 7 stars 6 stars 5 stars 4 stars 3 stars 2 stars 1 star Like Follow Followed TV-PG Action Adventure Drama Sci-Fi Release Date 1993 - 1999-00-00 Network CBS Showrunner Michael Piller, Ira Steven Behr Writers Rick Berman, Michael Piller Franchise(s) Star TrekCast
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